0:01 - Madeline 
Hey, so how did this week's rendition of the podcast go?

0:05 - Madeline 
I wasn't able to make it because I had some other things going on.

0:09 - Andy 
Yeah, you kind of ditched me. What's up with that? Excuse me. But no, it was a great episode. So it was about an an historic architect. Some people think a, some people say an

0:21 - Madeline 
Well, I say it's a historic because H is not a vowel.

0:25 - Andy 
Yeah, so we actually had that discussion as well between myself the project manager, Jessica. So I guess you can see which one we decided on with the title. But nonetheless, we talked about historic preservation with Laura Altman, and she's a historic preservation architect. And we learned a lot about Charleston, South Carolina. We learned a little bit about history of some of the houses there, but also how she just preserves houses, how she works. And she has a passion for that. So that was interesting. And that was one of her big reasons of what she's trying to do. Was there anything that you found interesting about the episode? I mean, I know you weren't here for it, but you did get to listen a little bit to some of the episodes.

1:09 - Madeline 
I thought it was interesting when she said that her husband's an architect and people ask, oh, are you two in the same space? Do you work together? And she goes, no. She just shuts that down immediately. We're not even in the same space, and I like working alone.

1:22 - Andy 
I thought that was kind of funny. Yeah, I mean, everybody has a different way of working and, you know, we have another episode coming up soon where the couple is in the same business. So, you'll have to check that one out coming up soon. Come back. Yeah. But everybody's got their different ways of working. Another thing that I found very interesting and inspiring as well about Laura was how she really cares about the quality of work And one thing she does is she pays special attention through the construction. And actually she has some construction background when she got started because she did a lot of field work. And so I think that gave her some insights and experience that helped her with her career. So those are a few things we learned about it, about the episode, but let's let the listener go to the episode.

2:18 - Madeline 
Without further ado.

2:20 - Andy 
My name is Andy Richardson. I'm a structural engineer. I've been doing this 26 years. This is my producer, Madeline, and we are here to learn about the why of professionals in the AEC industry so that you can learn your why.

2:38 - Andy 
Let's jump to the intro.

2:41 - Madeline 
Welcome to Enhance, an AEC podcast where we learn the why behind AEC professionals so that you can learn your why.

2:49 - Andy 
All right, we're live. Welcome to the Enhance podcast, Laura. Thank you. Glad to have you in studio today. How was the drive down?

2:57 - Laura 
It is a beautiful day. You wouldn't believe that it was 32 degrees. It just looked like a beautiful spring day. And that drive from Charleston Beaufort is always just so pretty, especially that one spot coming across the causeway.

3:11 - Andy 
Yeah.

3:12 - Laura 
Looking out both ways, all the marsh, just it makes it realize why we love living in the Lowcountry.

3:19 - Andy 
Yeah, definitely a great place to live, right? So, are you from the Lowcountry? I am.

3:27 - Laura 
I grew up in Charleston from second grade on. My mom was from Charleston, and so I lived in Charleston through high school. Went to Clemson for architecture school. And then took two years off and worked in Florence, South Carolina, which is where my husband is from, and so we worked in a small firm there, then went back to school. At that point, we'd gotten married right before grad school. We went back to school at Clemson to get a master's in architecture, both of us, and were able to do study abroad, spending a semester in Charleston through the Clemson architecture program there, and then a semester in Italy together, and then just one year in Clemson to finish up master's program.

4:10 - Andy 
Okay, and you met in architecture school? Oh, yes.

4:13 - Laura 
Sitting and drafting tables across from each other, and that's how we met and started dating.

4:20 - Andy 
Okay, awesome.

4:21 - Andy 
Yeah. So, what was the kind of how did that happen with the looking at each other or drafting table? Was there a story? Oh, yeah.

4:31 - Laura 
There's a story. Chris was throwing things at me like boys do, and And that was in second year of architecture school. We just happened to claim desks across from each other. He started as a second year student because he had done two years as a fine arts major at Francis Merian first and then transferred in. And I just remember the guy sitting next to him was so loud and I was like, oh my gosh, he's so loud and obnoxious. Ended up being one of our very good friends and was in our wedding. So we started out like that. The other funny thing is that he and I were born in the same hospital in Florence before I moved to Charleston, but we didn't meet till that second year of architecture school in Clemson. So a lot of small world things, especially when we went back to Florence to work in a small firm. We worked in the same firm together at that time because we were already dating and decided that after undergrad we were going to be in the same town. So we looked at jobs in Charleston and Florence and Florence just worked out better. So we were in a small firm there. That firm happened to be doing St. Luke's Lutheran Church, which was the church I'd gone to when I was real little, and Chris worked on it. There were just a lot of small world things. A lot of people that still remembered my family from back then. It's just kind of a neat story. The reason we went back to Florence was his parents were still living there, And so, but working in the same firm led us, like we ended up getting married at the end of that two years before grad school, but we decided after that, that we would not ever work in the same firm again, that we liked being able to come home and see each other and say, hey, how was your day? And not already know. So lots of people ask when I say, oh, this is my husband, he's also an architect. They're like, oh, do you work together? No. Completely different kinds of stuff. Okay.

6:30 - Andy 
And so you, I mean, obviously goes right into what you do. So what type of work do you do?

6:38 - Laura 
I focus on residential architecture and specifically historic restorations and renovations. I love to work in the downtown historic Charleston district and do just residential. I have chosen to stick with residential because the residential code and commercial codes are so different. I don't want to be a jack-of-all-trades, so I focus. My husband actually does more commercial, institutional work, everything from car dealerships and schools to higher education buildings, medical office buildings, all kinds of stuff. So completely different. We are not competing with each other. He is also a partner in his firm, and then I have my own firm.

7:20 - Andy 
Yes, okay. So you're a sole practitioner?

7:23 - Laura 
I am. I work by myself. I've had an intern once or twice, but I really prefer just to work by myself and stay involved with every piece and part of the project. So it's just me, LFA Architecture. I started my firm in 2013, so just over 11 years ago, which is pretty exciting for me. Congratulations. Thank you. I mean, when I made it to the one year, I was like, this is really and then five years and it just keeps going and it's just exciting and it stayed busy the whole time. But one of the reasons I started my firm and kind of I guess like in some of the stuff you sent me ahead of time, one of my core reasons for this was to provide full service to my clients. To stay involved with them and provide a consistent point of communication from the very beginning, the first dream or sketch, all the way through to move in. Because Because I feel strongly that having that consistent communication and then being on site during the construction or renovation is an important way of making sure that the client's desires and their dreams become a reality. Because there are a lot of conversations that happen in those design meetings early on, and even though I do very detailed drawings, they're still black and white drawings. There's still room for interpretation. So having being able to be on-site throughout construction means I can answer questions or if a contractor says hey We'd like to try doing this this way a little different I can say yeah that perfectly fits with what the goals were or no We did this specifically because of this this and this how they're going to use the house or whatever. It might be so Full service was one of those things. I feel like I have two niches in a way the full service and then the historic work Okay. They combined together.

9:17 - Andy 
Was there something that triggered that, the need for full service? It sounds like maybe there was something that's like, hey, when I start my business, we're doing full service, or maybe it might have been a series of things.

9:32 - Laura 
Yeah, I think it comes from, I spent the first, well, I started when we did that internship, that study abroad in Charleston during grad school. We had an opportunity to intern with a firm in Charleston and get class credit and get paid. So Chris and I ended up with Meadors, which was just a construction company at the time. And James Meadors had this interest in trying to pull in an architecture department because he saw the need of having everything in-house. So architecture, construction, of course, like the carpenters and framers, cabinetry, stone cutting like countertops. He had painters in house and roofers in house and everything. And so after undergrad, I ended up starting back there as my first real job, I guess, after school. I mean, after grad school, and I worked there for almost 10 years. And so that's kind of where I grew up professionally. And that collaboration and that full circle of having everything in house design build and helping develop the architecture department there, just really, it worked well. It made sense to be involved and to follow a project all the way through rather than the type of architects that do the drawings and then say, here, good luck to the client or to the contractor because they're just too many questions. I also feel like because I was involved in all that, I look at my drawings differently. I think about things differently. I think ahead differently than I might have if I went down a traditional path of architecture.

11:17 - Andy 
Right, right. So working for the builder in-house had a, would you say that had a significant impact on your?

11:25 - Laura 
For sure. So partly because when I first started there, I was the first architecture type person in that company and at that point I was an intern and just finished my master's but I wasn't licensed yet so I had to work under another architect technically to get the intern development hours to then be able to sit for the licensing exam. So there was a sole practitioner at a different firm that I kind of worked under but I was in the office at the construction company and because of just how James saw things I was also going to job sites on a regular basis. I was doing things that I came home to Chris so many times, I was like, this is not what an architect is supposed to be doing. But I did them anyway, frustrated as I was, and it made a difference and it made an impact. I was doing takeoffs for materials on a job site and placing orders. I was calling subcontractors and getting pricing and comparing options, deciding which subcontractor or which whatever the job and having to call and tell the one you've got it to call somebody else, which is the worst. Sorry, you didn't get this job. We chose somebody else, that kind of thing. I did construction schedules, working with the contract, the project manager on site to put together a construction schedule and then to follow through with it. I put together construction budgets and then every month we would go through the invoice and I would input every item from the invoice into that spreadsheet so we could see what we budgeted, what was spent so far, what we had remaining, all kinds of stuff like that. But on-site almost every day, I mean, even down to the point of taking meeting notes when I'm meeting with the client, the contractor, interior designer, whoever, the project manager, and then taking them out there and following through and making sure that the project manager was doing what you're supposed to do. All of that is not what your typical architect does, but because that. I just have so much more different experience than most residential architects that I feel like that brings a huge value to all of my projects. I was doing all of those things in addition to doing construction drawings and design work and interior stuff and all too. And I just love all parts of it. I get involved with a project and I'll tell a client, oh this is my favorite phase or oh we're getting ready to move into this part, this is my favorite favorite part. It's just, I'm lucky that I love what I do.

13:58 - Andy 
Yeah, that's awesome. And I mean, I think it's funny what you were saying about this is not what architect does. I think about, you know, the original definition of an architect, like a master builder, and we've redefined it in terms of, you know, I think the modern definition is more like, okay, drawings and design. How do you define architecture?

14:23 - Laura 
I guess I define my job as the person that handles taking a dream and making it a reality. That includes creating designs and sketches and options that get developed into construction drawings, but then I feel strongly about being part of making sure that gets implemented. And so on different projects, it means different things. I have a project right now where, for better or worse, I am one of those people that says, well, if it's not getting done, I'd better do it. Or if it's not getting done right, I'll do it myself. And so the contractor's not necessarily putting together a schedule. So I've put together a schedule so that we can get the project finished. I've put together a budget based on his basics to make sure we finish project on time and on a reasonable budget. Because I have that experience, because I know it needs to be part of the process, even though I shouldn't necessarily be doing it. But yeah, I'd say that the architect's job is to take a dream and see it through to a reality by creating the design and the drawings, and then making sure they get built right. Yeah, okay. As an advocate for the client.

15:48 - Andy 
That's a very complete definition, so you've thought through that one quite a bit.

15:53 - Laura 
I guess it just comes from experience, maybe. My own experience, and everybody's is different, but

15:58 - Andy 
Yeah, I mean, I can say from my experience, obviously I have an experience as a structural engineer, but also I have a limited experience of working with architects, and our little addition that we did, I really appreciated, you know, the architect we finally went with and helping us get it done right and making sure it gets done to completion, you know, because what was interesting to me in that experience was realizing the construction phase is a part of the design process, in my opinion, because you get to where you can't show everything on a piece of paper, number one, and then, you know, I'm supposed to understand three dimensions as an engineer, but when, you know, you get out there and you're like, you know, what if we did this other thing? So it's amazing how that works, right? Like how do you work with that during construction? Do you see that as a phase of design?

16:59 - Laura 
Oh yes, and I include that with all of my projects. I actually include construction, the construction phase, which I later is contract administration. My job is to make sure the contract documents, the drawings, the specifications are followed. So I include that as part of my fixed fee. I don't give people an option for it because I feel it's so important. And maybe part of it's because I might be a little bit of a control freak and I want to see the work I've done on paper become a reality, but also because sometimes I like to procrastinate a decision. And to be able to stand on site with a client and say, OK, well, this is kind of how we thought about it in paper. But we said we would look at it once the framing was going up. And you can stand it and feel it better and get a better sense of what needs to be where. Even though we work in, you and I both work in Revit in 3D, building information modeling software, where we can see it in a computer 3D, there's still a limitation to it. And so being able to site throughout the process, the construction process, we can make adjustments if we need to.

18:07 - Andy 
Yeah, okay. I think that's really helpful that you have that full service mentality. So, thinking back, or I want to think, you know, help some of the younger architects and younger professionals, and if they're listening, hopefully, right? But what would you tell them, I mean, as far as an experience to, it sounds like this is a really important experience for the construction. So, how can they get that? I mean, can you give them some advice on that front?

18:36 - Laura 
Yes. So, I think there are a couple of different aspects of this in terms of my advice to a younger architect or architecture student. One, when you go to find your first internship, go for a small firm even in a small town. You don't need to go to New York and be in a big high-powered firm because you're only going to do say stair details or bathroom stall details. If you're in a small firm, you're going to get an experience across the whole process of design, from schematics to construction. You'll get to work on all different kinds of details and projects and drawings. That alone, I think, was very important for me and for Chris, because we ended up in a small firm in Florence, whereas some of our friends that graduated from Clemson went to Charlotte or to New York and tried get experience there, but they were just pigeonholed as interns. Another aspect is that even during college I got involved with Habitat for Humanity and being able to volunteer with an organization like Habitat where you're building houses, it helps you understand how buildings go together and how it really works and I think that's one thing that's missing in architecture school these days they're so focused on the theory of design and being creative and all of that, that they're missing the part about how do we really put buildings together so that they stay standing, so they keep water out, all of that kind of stuff. So I really value my time I spent doing habitat work, but then also because I was in a construction firm for almost 10 years, I was on site, so I was seeing how the buildings were going together. So that's another area that if you're looking for an internship and you can't find an internship in an architecture firm, try a construction firm. A lot of construction firms now include a design build aspect anyway, like a lot of contractors have a drafts person or have an interiors person to help with that process because they're trying to make their process more seamless or more turnkey. So there are opportunities to be involved on that side of things. And I think that makes a big difference, both in how I design things now, because I understand how they go together, but it also makes a difference when I'm interacting with the contractors on my project. They know I'm not just talking from the office world or the design theory world. They know I've got the experience that I understand it and because, and I think that allows them to respect me a little bit more and we can collaborate. That's the other thing is that by doing this full service, it's really a big collaboration between the client, the contractor, me, an interior designer if there is one, the structural engineer or whoever else. And when you collaborate like that and take a team approach, it's gonna be a better project in the long run. We all bring our experience and the things learn from mistakes and it just makes a better project. There was something else along those lines, but I've forgotten what I was gonna say. Yeah, if it comes back to you.

21:54 - Andy 
I'll let you know. But I like the habitat, you know, it reminds me all the way back. I almost forgot that I even did that, but I did some of that when I was in college and it's, I mean, it's a great way to meet people, too.

22:11 - Laura 
It is. I just remember, so at Clemson, they build a house on Bowman Field during homecoming. They still do it. Okay. I graduated from Clemson a long time ago, it feels like, What year did you graduate? I graduated in 2000 from undergrad and then 04 for grad school. Yeah, I'm 98. Okay, so maybe you were at Clemson and maybe you helped build a homecoming house because it's been going on for a long time.

22:35 - Andy 
Yeah, these we did were because I was at Clemson as well. The ones we did, they were just out, I don't remember what neighborhood, just out in the neighborhood.

22:45 - Laura 
It wasn't the Bowman Field one. So I started on that my freshman year fall because I was involved with Lutheran Campus Ministry, and the pastor that did Lutheran Campus Ministry, LCM, was also an advisor for the Clemson University Habitat chapter, and so he pulled all of us in. So I just remember my freshman year being on a roof, putting on shingles, learning from someone who was a science major, who was a couple years older than me, and then doing spring break trips. And then I ended up my senior thesis project at Clemson was to design, because we could create our own projects, I designed a Habitat for Humanity neighborhood with three prototypical houses. And then I was able to go back the next spring and help build them during a spring collegiate challenge blitz build. They brought in college groups during spring break that year from all over the country. To build those houses, and I got to help build them. Yeah, that's really cool. So that was really, that was just a, I mean, you know what I mean about how, like when you're standing there and holding a hammer or understanding how the top plate goes on top and how they just, all the different things interact, it just makes more sense when you're drawing it in Revit and you're drawing these walls, you can picture it more in your head, I guess.

24:02 - Andy 
Exactly, yeah. I mean, we had a guy that started here and he came from overseas, so he was, he didn't know what a two-by-four was. So, I mean, just little things like that, like you can learn what a two-by-four is, you know, or I remember the painting, like we did a lot of paintings, and so I learned a lot of, the guy that was in charge of, I guess superintendent would, it would be called at that point. I don't know what they call a, I guess it's still a superintendent, but He was very detail-oriented when it came to painting. You didn't have drips, you didn't have holidays, you had to get it right. Obviously, the other advantage of Habitat is it's a great organization. You're helping people build houses. I want to get into historic preservation some, since that's your claim to fame.

24:59 - Laura 
It's my passion.

25:00 - Andy 
What started that passion?

25:02 - Laura 
That started also at METRS because METRS did a lot of historic work, high-end residential. And specifically, I had one project with a client who's still a good friend. And this was probably 2006 or 2007. So early in those years at METRS. And it was an old house that we had to take apart Like when we went in, the client had bought it, it hadn't been renovated at all. I remember standing on the piazza that had been enclosed like as a bathroom, and the wall of piazza was leaning out from the original wall of the house, and they had stuffed in newspapers and caulk tubes. So it all ended up like as part of the restoration, it was a big project. We took apart parts of the building, and I just remember being out there with Philmore Wilson, who's one of my mentors, from Meadors. He was a history teacher, but he's also essentially a master craftsman and just has a lot of great qualities. So he was great about pointing out and teaching things. And as we take apart this piazza and to look up and to see the evolution of, oh, we think this piazza might have been narrower originally. And here's how it went together and putting that whole building It just, I think that's when I fell in love with historic buildings, with the history and thinking about how people built them originally and how can we then take those historic buildings, repair them as needed, just take care of them. We're just one step in the process. Like we're leaving a legacy for the next people. We're just the caretakers of these buildings. They're not really ours. But to do all of that and make it, functional and fitting and livable for modern families, for our lifestyle these days. Because back then they didn't always have bathrooms, or they had one bathroom for the whole house, or they had closets that were this big. And so trying to take that to be respectful of the history, but also tweak the house enough to make it really functional.

27:18 - Laura 
I just, I love that challenge.

27:20 - Andy 
Yeah, and Charles quite a bit of that, right?

27:24 - Laura 
I mean, for sure.

27:26 - Andy 
Can you talk about that some, like Charleston and working in there doing the historic preservation? Just expand on that.

27:33 - Laura 
Charleston has its challenges with historic preservation because a lot of people come in and they're like, well, I bought this property. This is my property. I can do what I want, but Charleston has, for good reason, a lot of organizations that oversee what you can can and can't do on a historic house because we want to maintain the history. We don't want to lose historic buildings and we want to maintain that for future generations, but also for current property values and all of that too, which makes a big difference. I mean, that's why people have come here, come to Charleston to buy these old houses or to live in this historic city with how walkable it is. So we have the Board of Architecture Review that has over anything on the exterior of the houses in the historic district, if it's visible from the public right-of-way, like from a sidewalk or an alley or a street. And it can be challenging. There are two preservation groups, Historic Charleston Foundation and the Preservation Society of Charleston, which also advocate for preservation of these old buildings, and both for architecture but also for cultural reasons. So I've created good relationships with the city staff, with the Board of Architecture Review folks, and with the preservation organizations. And I'm actually part of the BAR now, the small board. There's a large for big, big projects, like the hospital projects and all, or hotels, and then the BAR small for more residential, like the stuff that I typically work on. So I've been able to be part of that. And there are pros and cons, but I think a lot of it comes down to being respectful of the history and also being logical because there are times when what's always been done or what's historically accurate may not be the best thing for the long term of that building or may not be the best way to make sure that a building gets preserved because it's too costly. So there are ongoing discussions about that. It breaks my heart to drive through Charleston. They're just areas where buildings are falling down because the owners, it may be a family that's been there forever. There are a ton of different heirs. Nobody really knows who owns it. They don't want to sell it necessarily, but they may not have the money to take care of the building. And it breaks my heart to see those falling down. I just want to go give them some love and bring them back to life. But it raises a question. Historic preservation is expensive. It can be very expensive to repair old windows. It can be cheaper to put in a vinyl window. But that's not historically accurate. And so there are a lot of discussions that are going to be going on for a long time. So I try to stay involved with that to give my two cents, but also trying to balance it.

30:34 - Andy 
So what is your two cents on something like that, the window? As an example or maybe there's another example?

30:41 - Laura 
Well I think in general if you think about it to me it seems like well one there's a saying the most sustainable building is one you don't tear down. When we think about just for future generations in general in our world our environment to be able to repair a building is going to be better for everything in the long run. Balancing that, to me it seems like in some cases, for instance, we were doing a site visit as part of the board recently and the only thing that was left of this poor house was the front wall. They had essentially, the request before the board was demolition by, sorry, approval for after the fact demolition The guy, the contractor had essentially demolished the whole house except for the front wall and the front porch and rebuilt it. And to me that seems like one that's a lot of materials, that's a lot of money. So in some ways I think they're restoring the buildings if we can find the right methods is going to be cheaper and better in the long run. The biggest aspect of the is avoiding deferred maintenance. When you defer maintenance on a house, it's only gonna be more expensive. If you don't take care of that leak in the roof, it's going to continue leaking. The hole is gonna get bigger, the wood underneath it's gonna rot, it's gonna be more expensive to repair it. And that's where I think that we need to do more advocating and figure out ways to help folks do the repairs earlier on. So we don't end up with demolition by neglect where these buildings just get to a point where they're in such bad shape that it really does cost a lot to repair them. And so people can't afford it. So then they leave it for a little bit longer in hopes that it'll fall in on itself and just to be demolished by itself. So that's a challenge for us.

32:54 - Andy 
So, yeah, I was going to ask about kind of back to Charleston at large and the history aspect of it. Like what, I'm in Beaufort, so I'm not as much Charleston. We're trying to do work there, but, and I'm sure we'll get some work. But the question I'm getting at is like a little bit more about the history in terms of like what's the first house that was built or, I mean, did Sherman leave anything in its tracks or so maybe some things about that. Can you give us some context as far as history?

33:29 - Laura 
I can do my best. I do admit I do not have a degree in historic preservation or in history in general. I did the architecture path and fell into the historic preservation. So a lot of times when I'm working on buildings, I have to do some research. Sherman did spare Charleston. Charleston didn't get burned the way Columbia did in other cities. So there are a lot old buildings, even back to, I think we have some that are pre-1800. But a lot of the buildings that we work on, the one I mentioned earlier that I worked on at Matters that was the one that kind of kick-started my love of historic preservation, that one was built in 1840. I'm working on one right now that's fascinating because it was built pre-1888, and I can tell that by looking at old Sanborn fire maps, fire insurance maps, but it was moved from one location on Rutledge to a different location. And in the late 1890s, before it was moved, they Victorianized it in a way, like added some Victorian elements. So I enjoy doing some of that historic research project by project. We of course have some historic homes that are owned by the Historic Charleston Foundation, that are museum houses. So you have some of those. But then you'll have a street that has houses that were built pre-1880s, then across the street might be a 1960s brick ranch, and then next to it a 1920s home. It can be a big mix. It just depends. So a lot of it comes down to, for me, doing the research on each project.

35:12 - Andy 
Yeah. So is there a quintessential style that defines the historic district or is it very?

35:18 - Laura 
There are a lot of Charleston single houses which are an architectural prototype. It's a narrow house with a long porch on one side, a piazza, usually two or even three stories on the one side. Those typically, if I have my stuff right, I think they typically face south or west because the intent was that that those porches would shade the windows for the interiors to help with passive cooling. So that you had shade during the hot summers, the afternoon sunshine, provide shade and then some cooling. The single houses were narrow, so from the short end would face the street, and then you have the piazza on one side, and an entry door on the piazza with a solid wall. So it gave privacy to that porch. Enter through that there would be a room at the front and then a central stair usually and another room and two or three stories attic space with dormers. A lot of times the porch is wrapped around and then over time they were added on to. Often there was a carriage house or a smaller building in the back and over time those would get connected to the main house with what we call a hyphen. That helps often dictate how we look at additions these days, that there's sort of a typology for historic homes, where as you add on, you add on to the back, where it's less visible from the street, it's a little bit smaller as it keeps going back, smaller, shorter, that kind of thing. So that the Charleston single house is very typical of Charleston, but we have a lot of different styles. There's still a lot of the, Georgian and colonial that might have columns at the front or Victorian. There was a lot of construction, I believe, in the early 1900s, 1900s, 1920s, because as Charleston grew, they infilled areas that were marsh or were mill ponds and kept expanding. And so then you have the homes that were built in those eras that are now historic. And at that point, the homes in the middle of peninsula were already historic. So it's interesting to see the progression. So different eras, different neighborhoods have different styles too because of just the general development from that center core outward. We also, this is probably a tangent, but we in Charleston, because we continued to build on marshland or infill mill ponds or essentially try to grow the peninsula into the water, we deal with a lot of flooding and we're dealing with rising waters now. And so that is a whole nother aspect that affects historic preservation and architecture in general in Charleston, because we have to look at the base flood elevations. And is the historic house lower than that? Is it in danger of being flooded? Do we elevate these houses by having a house mover come in, lift them up a little bit, taller piers underneath, things like that. And just, it's fascinating looking at the peninsula and the history. And if you look at old maps of where there were creeks, where there were marshes, and then you look at today's maps, when it floods on just a sunny day that has a high tide, it correlates. The streets have flooded. Are the places where there used to be creeks.

38:59 - Laura 
It's fascinating.

38:59 - Laura 
But it does add to the historic preservation. For years and years, they encouraged us to get a FEMA variance for historic homes so that we didn't have to elevate them or bring them up to current flood codes because they were historic. Now, we're encouraging people to elevate those houses because to preserve them, we don't want them sitting in the water. It's better to elevate in the long run, and so we provide, I worked with a committee that put together some guidelines for how can we elevate these but maintain the character, the historic character, and not lose that in the long run.

39:36 - Andy 
Well, we did have, I mean, we've had a few hurricanes, and really, I would say they're mild hurricanes. I mean, Irma had some flood surge. The last one, I think, was 22. We had some surge, right?

39:47 - Laura 
We had three in a row, and I don't remember which years those were. Maybe it was like 16, 17, 18, we had the three in a row that caused a lot of flooding in Charleston. There was another one more recently, but we're just having a lot more flooding now, even unrelated to a tropical storm or hurricane. It could be related to just a rainstorm, but happens at the same time as a king tide, which happens on certain full moons. I haven't learned all the science of it yet. And then there are days, literally, when the streets flood because of just the high tides now. It just seeps up.

40:27 - Andy 
Okay.

40:28 - Andy 
So tide, flood, and the water aspect is a big factor.

40:32 - Laura 
It is, because we don't want to lose these buildings to water over time. And many of them, when they were built, it's not like they were built on concrete foundations. They're built on dirt and on brick piers, and over time, You know, from the structural aspect, the mortar deteriorates and the brick piers, like the mortar just goes, it turns to sand and just kind of falls out. And so the more water that's in it, and if it's salt water, it creates even more problems.

41:04 - Andy 
Yes, definitely. And I've seen too, where the brick piers are just stacked up on the soil.

41:10 - Laura 
Yes, exactly.

41:11 - Andy 
So that brings up a lot of questions about structural safety. There's my realm. I suppose or not I suppose but there's my realm is making sure that it's safety and then questions about that you know because we've had to deal with that aspect of historical properties where it's really difficult to meet the wind load because Charles is in a high wind load area and seismic area and so have you had to deal with that before in terms of

41:39 - Laura 
So for the most part I haven't had to deal with it directly. I think I think we are, it is important to consider. And I always bring in a structural engineer. So I really haven't had to deal with it directly because I ask my structural engineers to help. But going back to what you said about seismic, we had a huge earthquake in 1886, I think was the year. We haven't had one since then. There's gonna be a big one. So I did have one project that was an exterior restoration of a building, a masonry building. And it started because the stucco was falling off the building, therefore endangering people on the sidewalk because it was right on the sidewalk, zero lot line, all four sides. And we worked together with a masonry restoration company and a structural engineer that was used to doing historic kind of work, had to sound all of the the stucco, pulled off almost all of the stucco, and then they put in what we called stitches, the little spiral, almost like the size of a pencil, metal rods, into the mortar joints and then re-mortared them in an effort to try to make sure that building would survive an earthquake and the seismic stuff, because I think, aren't the masonry buildings more prone seismic concerns?

43:06 - Laura 
Well, yeah, I mean, there's a couple issues.

43:09 - Andy 
Number one, it's unreinforced back in the... Yeah, like three wide brick. It's just not...

43:14 - Laura 
Oh, yeah, that's definitely unreinforced.

43:15 - Andy 
And then it's heavier.

43:17 - Andy 
And seismic is about height and weight. The heavier it is and the taller it is, the more seismicity, because it's like the earth is moving, but the building is not. It's like being in the back of a pickup truck and somebody slams on the brakes. So the heavier and taller you are, the more likely you're gonna fall over. Masonry buildings are very heavy and they can be tall and then they're unreinforced so that makes them... We had Siri helping us out. Okay. I must have said something that sounded like Siri.

44:01 - Andy 
Is helping us out today. Yep. Well, I wanted to, I guess one thing that's really interesting to me about historic, which you started talking about, was the porches and the way that we design historically in terms of like, by the way, it's hot down here in Charleston.

44:24 - Laura 
Not today, but typically speaking. Typically speaking.

44:27 - Andy 
And so, I guess, like how they built in the 1800s and the early 1900s, we didn't have air conditioning and we didn't have modern conveniences. So talk about that, like how did that impact the design?

44:44 - Laura 
That, I think, especially with the Charleston single house, I think that's a great prototype and people have done studies on it, but they specifically failed south or west. So if you look at a street, all of the porches would have been on the same side. And those single houses were only one room wide, so they could get the breeze through easier coming from the water through the porch, through the shaded porch. So you had the porch facing south or west to shade the bulk of the building during the hottest part of the day. And then also trying to capture the breezes because that had to do with the orientation also. Let's see, does that cover it? Do you remember what else?

45:32 - Andy 
Like porches and how that impact and then was there any?

45:36 - Laura 
Operable windows, I mean everything, double hung windows or French doors, sometimes triple hung windows which are really cool because then they would go all the way to the floor and you could raise them up. But trying to adjust from that, were very breathable. That was the intent. Oh, fireplaces because they didn't have heat either necessarily. So, fireplaces in every room for the winters that weren't super cold but they still get cold and I can only imagine living back then. Um but now trying to adapt those houses to today with air conditioning has has its own challenges with they're very breathable houses So you put air conditioning in. Well, air conditioning is intended to circulate, but it's sucking in the hot, humid air from outside because there's no plywood or weather barrier on the outside the way we design buildings now. And we can't necessarily go through and take off all the siding. The masonry is porous. It's going to have moisture in it when you do air conditioning inside. I don't know all the science of this, but I know to know that that air conditioning pulls the moisture through the walls. So it is a challenge. We can't go back to those days because everybody wants to be comfortable, but it does create challenges with, you know, we've got single-pane windows in these old houses and preservation standards say you have to keep them that way.

47:11 - Andy 
Yeah, so yeah, I mean I just thought it was interesting to think about some of the old technologies. I don't know if you mentioned the transoms. I guess that was that was something I know like if you even like a 1950s house you see a lot of those.

47:28 - Laura 
Right, the door transoms would be operable so even if you closed a door throughout like at the interior of the house you can close the door but open the windows so it can let some of that hot air flow out air flow throughout the house. I've even had clients now do new houses want operable transoms. High ceilings were another part of it, so that in the summertime the heat was rising. Didn't help in the wintertime, but I guess they looked at it as we have hotter, more hot days than cold days. So the higher ceilings allowed the heat to rise and hopefully make the rest of it a little bit cooler with that just natural circulation.

48:10 - Andy 
Yeah, somehow we got lower ceilings because of cost probably and then now it's more popular to have a higher ceiling again. Yes.

48:19 - Laura 
And go super high which is kind of really counterintuitive because then trying these days trying to heat and cool those 12-foot ceilings is kind of crazy.

48:30 - Andy 
Yeah that's true. But it's interesting to me how or I guess is there anything you can learn from that in work too at times.

48:41 - Laura 
I do. I try to avoid the newer. I love the historic work because there's something to work from There's something to inspire the design. I don't mind doing new construction when it builds on figuratively, builds on our architecture of the South or the historic architecture, the vernacular. So yes, I do some new construction. Where were you going with that?

49:05 - Andy 
Sorry. Just like does less lessons learned from the past as far as, okay, like the porches or the transoms, and I think we can respect the people that were before, the designers and the architects that worked in the 1800s and see, these people really had a lot of, they put a lot of thought into these things, you know.

49:27 - Laura 
Even if there wasn't a designer, maybe it was just somebody built. Like it came out of experience. There are a lot of call high crawl spaces in Charleston because they knew that there was going to be some water coming up and down. There are the high ceilings, like we said, the porches, the orientation of the building to best capture breezes and shade. And all of that can be used. There are a lot of folks, and I'm not quite as good about it, about the passive design, passive energy measures that we can use. Deeper overhangs is another aspect that both provides shade but also gets our rainwater farther away from the building because rainwater at the foot of the building creates issues. Definitely things to be learned from the historic architecture. And then there are things that we learn that we improve on. You know, they used to do parapet walls, masonry walls that would go all the way up above the roof and just parge the top with stucco. Well, stucco and the parging is porous. It's still going to let moisture in and that moisture goes down through the wall and gets into the wood members. So now we try to put copper on the top because that's going to keep the water out and preserve these buildings long term. And sometimes those kinds of things of we learn from the mistakes of the past as well as the good things from the past. Right.

50:55 - Andy 
The old adage of they don't build it like they used to sometimes is a good thing, right?

51:00 - Laura 
Right.

51:00 - Andy 
But like the parging, what is parging for those that maybe don't know what that is?

51:05 - Laura 
So on a, in the particular one I'm thinking of right now is where they take the masonry walls up past the slope of the roof and it might be angled, just sticks up higher. And parging, they would take the stucco and put it over the top and I guess reparge it every so often and make it real smooth. In an effort to keep the water out or send the water off, but it was a stucco coating, and stucco is just porous. It soaks up water and moisture over time, and that moisture then soaks into the brick and just travels down. Just like we have problems right now with, like you said before, the brick just sitting, the foundations, the piers or foundation walls sitting right on the dirt, that dirt, we have high water table of salt water and so that moisture and salt is going up into the walls because it just soaks it up like a sponge and creates issues where it'll show up in cracks with efflorescence and the kind of bubbly white stuff on the outside of a stucco building or outside of a brick building just with the continual rising water.

52:18 - Andy 
Yeah I've seen a few phenomenons. One is you see this white powder adjacent, like right beside the brick wall. And it's like three, four inches thick. And then you look and you see the mortar lines are, I guess, broken down. So all that mortar is just falling onto this floor because it's broken down mortar. And then also, I've seen the same thing with like modern concrete masonry where it's broken down because of the salt water, or I don't know if there's chemicals in the salt water that beyond just salt, but definitely some of that stuff can really break down the chemicals in the materials. So I want to move to a bit of technology. I mean, you seem to be up on using BIM and Revit. Why are you using Revit and why are you using BIM? Do you think that's important? Do you think that helps?

53:20 - Laura 
I do. So, when it wasn't very long after I got out of grad school that at METRS, we started building up our architecture department. So, within a year, we had three of us, and we jumped in cold turkey and to Revit. And so, I've been doing Revit since 2005, I think. Okay. So, for a long time. 20 years. Yeah. And I really think, yes, there's, it's For me, it's very important for several reasons. By working in 3D, one, we're essentially building it the way we would build it in real life. So I'm thinking through all of the materials and thinking through roof intersections. I can look at it 3D and see where I've got a problem where either a roof can't resolve or we're going to have a weird issue with trim even before we get into the field and trying to build it in reality. It's helped me before to show contractors how these roofs are going to work. Or just different weird intersections. It helps clients to see perspective views, interior and exterior perspective views, and it helps for municipal approvals, getting through zoning boards and board of architecture review, because it gives me an opportunity to show those boards, especially the ones that are reviewing from a right-of-way or from a neighbor's yard and they want to understand, well, it sure looks really big in a flat elevation, but when you look at it in 3D and you're looking down, you know, like you have a photograph and then you show them the 3D drawing perspective, they can better understand how big that addition might be, how tall it is, or how not visible it is because of the angles of different buildings. However, I have kept it very simple. All of my perspective drawings are still just black I haven't taken the technology to that step of virtual reality where I'm applying, where I'm making it look like a photograph. I am hesitant to do that because a lot of times clients will see that and think that it's finished and it's going to look exactly like that. And then one, what if I can't make it look that way? Or what if they don't like it, but they feel like it's too finished and they can't tell me because they feel like it's going backwards. Or wasting money or they just feel like it's too far gone and we can't go backwards. So I try to keep it simplified. I haven't jumped on the technology bandwagon of having the things and giving them the walkthrough or any of that. I use photographs and samples and drawings and I say we have to imagine this. So that everybody's imagination is a little fuzzy and when it becomes a reality, we can tweak it if we need to but at least hopefully we're not holding up a picture and said, oh, but you said it was gonna look just like this, and the reality couldn't be that way. I also, in terms of technology, a lot of people are using laser scanning and point clouds and all of that for scanning buildings. There's a lot of value in that, especially for historic buildings that are not square. They're not plumb or level. They're all a little skewed. I haven't jumped on that bandwagon yet. I just, haven't been able to. I still like the old school method of going into a house and measuring it myself with a tape measure. I use a laser measure to get long distances, but to go in and really walk through and in that process, I see and feel the building more fully. I feel like it makes it challenging because inevitably my measurements don't add up perfectly because something's not square and it's hard with Revit. To build a not square building. Revit doesn't like things that are off axis. But there are a lot more technologies out there that are helpful. My husband and I have talked plenty of times though, the old technologies of being able to sketch, especially in a client meeting, it's an invaluable skill. And I would say going back to our younger architect, or those still coming up through school, learn to sketch. Learn and understand how to draw a plan and an elevation by hand because there are times when you need to do that in front of a client. Right, right.

57:44 - Andy 
Yeah, I mean, if all you know is just, okay, well, let me get my Revit out, is that going to help you when you need something in a field or in a meeting? You know, you may not. And also, I mean, it's just not designed for that type of collaboration, right? Like, you know, to work on a computer. And maybe that's the next big technology is to have some of that. But I think having the ability just to pull out a napkin like right now and just start sketching something, you may not have that handy. So I definitely agree. I mean, anybody, even including engineers, I see that as something where the ability is starting to be lost. Are they still doing that in school right now?

58:33 - Laura 
I think so, and when you're building in 3D in a computer program, you don't have to as fully understand like back when we did it with even a drafting table. We had a plan, and then you had to extrapolate that up using the lines and understanding. I don't know. It's just it's hard to explain, but I don't think they're teaching that anymore. Hand drawing and even when we when we were using just AutoCAD and having to do it, but in a computer and you're still...it's like you're drawing hand-drawn lines and then having to look at that plan and be able to understand the three-dimensionality enough in your own head to draw the flat elevation. Now we draw the plan, we plop in a window, we click a button and the elevation is there, which is nice, but we lose something in the process. Right, right.

59:25 - Andy 
Yeah, I don't know what the educational system needs to make sure we maintain. Do you have any suggestions for that?

59:32 - Laura 
We, Chris and I, have lots of discussions about that. I don't end up with interns very often. I know I should and I should give back, but it's hard as a single person in a firm and juggling and trying to then train somebody. Chris and I have a lot of discussions because his firm's larger and so they take interns more often. I think being able to have interns internships or co-ops. I know a lot of engineering degrees offer co-ops through the school programs. Why don't architecture students do that? Or at least I don't think they do at Clemson. And that's what I'm kind of most familiar with. But that could be a huge value to students to be able to spend a few semesters at school and then spend a semester in the real world in a firm and back and forth would be one part of it. I still feel like it would be kind of nice if we had the opportunity to do apprenticeships, like if somebody didn't want to go to college and to really, there's so much to be learned from architects that are older than us that have the experience, contractors that are older than us that have had years and years of experience. There's just a lot to gain a lot of wisdom there that you can't always get in a school setting.

1:00:50 - Andy 
Yeah. Okay. Um, I guess thinking about a few more questions here and we can you know start winding down but I would be remiss if I didn't get into one of the core purposes of the podcast really just understanding I mean we've already hit on a lot of it you know understanding your why if you will like what drives you what your passion is so I think that's important important to me to understand that about the guests we have on because what's the point of just doing Revit and doing drawings if there's not a why behind it? So can you talk about that?

1:01:33 - Laura 
Beyond just like we have to make money and pay the mortgage and that kind of stuff. For me, I think it comes down to like going way back, I think it really comes down to home. An important aspect for everyone. And I guess when I started with the Habitat for Humanity stuff back freshman year of college, that there was something about that that has kind of carried itself through. To have an opportunity to work with clients to understand how they live or what's changing in their lives that then requires a change in how they're their house works for them, and having a chance to create a home that truly works for them, for their family, for their situation in life, and for thinking about the future and how they might age in place in their house, or have a house where their grandkids can come, or have a house where it works for their current little kids but it's gonna work for their teenage kids. There's just something about home that is all, so personal, so special, and I love being able to help make that a reality for people. And then to marry that with taking a historic home that has served generations previously in different ways, to save that home, both the character of it, the architecture of it, but also the function, not just making it a museum, but making it function, carry on its function home as it was 200 years ago for our current lifestyle without losing the historic fabric, without losing the character, but just adding our chapter to the history in a way.

1:03:23 - Andy 
Yeah, it sounds like a really exciting career and a really exciting job that you have. I do love what I do.

1:03:32 - Laura 
When I get to talking about it, it just reminds me how I love what I do. I do get to know my clients pretty well, make friends with them in a way because it's such a personal thing too. That was one thing we were talking about future architects or architects that are aspiring to be work in the residential field. I think it's important to remember to listen to clients because especially with residential because homes are so personal. We can't just assume we know what each home needs or how it needs to work. You've got to really listen. You've got to be able to take the criticism when somebody says no that's not going to work for us and to understand it, to learn from it, to know that sometimes what clients don't like is just as helpful as them telling you what they do like, And to remember that residential clients especially may only do a house once. They're not, they don't know all the architecture terms. They may not understand floor plans or elevations. They may not understand or know what words to use to describe what they want in their house. So it takes a lot of listening and communicating and making sure you're understanding what they're hearing.

1:04:47 - Andy 
Have you ever had a conflict where you feel like that's not what you really want? That's not what you really need? Because you're listening, but you're also guiding, right? I guess, how do you balance that? Because I can tell you I've had experience where I told the architect, the thing we described earlier, we told the architect what we thought we wanted and what we thought we needed, and he's like, you don't need that. So have you ever had a situation like that?

1:05:18 - Laura 
So I do, and a lot of times the way I approach that, and this comes from that background at Metters, James as a mentor saying, always give the client what they want first. The first option you present is what they've asked for. And then you say, but I think this could work really well for you. And you present a different option. You talk through it. And sometimes that works. But yes, there have definitely been times where what they say they want isn't what I feel like would work best. And sometimes it still goes that way. And they're OK with it. Sometimes it's because they don't know how to ask for what they really want or don't know how to describe it, and sometimes it's because they're asking for something because it's the only thing they know to ask for, and I can provide just an alternate solution. Like they ask for something because they think this is the way to solve or to achieve our goal for this space, and I can just provide a different option that achieves it in a little bit better way.

1:06:22 - Andy 
Yeah, okay. Yeah, I mean because you went to architecture school to work on buildings, and you're actually working with people, right?

1:06:29 - Laura 
Right, which leads to another thing. All of you out there that are in architecture school, take some marriage counseling classes, because I swear in residential, they should have put us through marriage counseling courses or something, because you're not only dealing with people, but you're often dealing with two people that don't always have exactly the same opinion, a husband and wife, or you just never know. I've had ones where it's a husband and wife on one side and the in-laws. You know, it just depends on who you're dealing with, but there's often, you've got to balance what he wants and what she wants and in terms of style or in terms of spaces and make everybody happy.

1:07:14 - Andy 
Right, and I'm sure you've got some interesting, was there anything, maybe not specifics as far as people go, but did you have any examples examples where like, man, that one really went awry and you had to bring it back?

1:07:29 - Laura 
Oh, I don't know. Not off the top of my head. I'm sure there have been ones. There have definitely been ones where, you know, and this may be stereotypical, but oftentimes the husband has a lot less say in the process. And the wife will even say whatever she wants. I want whatever she wants. A while, he'll have something he wants, she didn't want it. And trying to get that in in a safe way that she'll like okay has been a fun challenge sometimes. That one thing he wanted.

1:08:02 - Andy 
That one thing he wanted, I'm like, I have to get this in for him.

1:08:07 - Laura 
Yeah. So that's good.

1:08:08 - Andy 
I'm glad you...

1:08:09 - Laura 
Including some orange. I did, I had one client that wanted a brewery and that was the only room he wanted and he wanted some orange in there. Go Tigers. And we got it in.

1:08:20 - Andy 
Yeah, nice. In a safe way. In a safe way, yeah. And you got your orange on today. You're kind of like your Texas orange.

1:08:28 - Laura 
I love orange.

1:08:29 - Andy 
Any shade of orange as long as it's not Tennessee. Yeah, I guess Texas, they got the better of us, so I guess, but we've kind of followed our questionnaire here that my project manager Jessica put together for me, but was there anything that I didn't hit on that you think you really want to to mention? Obviously, I'll give you an opportunity to plug, but before that, was there anything you wanted to mention or anything you wanted to touch on?

1:08:58 - Laura 
I don't think so.

1:08:59 - Andy 
We've covered a lot of ground. Yeah, I think so. I mean, I really enjoyed everything that you offered, and I just learned a lot about, you know, historic preservation and what you do. I guess the working at home, I mean, it's 2025, It's not uncommon. And then also you have some kids running around. I do. So maybe just hit on that briefly. Is there anything like working at home, working with kids, or we've already talked about your Chris and just working with him, but anything about that aspect, like your personal life, combining that with your work life?

1:09:38 - Laura 
Yeah, so when I started my firm, I started working at home because because it was starting out with nothing. And so it just made sense. And then as we moved, we moved to a different house, had one of those formal living rooms, 1970s house, not the most architecturally fabulous for a couple of architects, but it worked. But I've been able to work at home, have my space, I have it set up, it feels professional. And I can, for whatever it's worth, I can kind of compartmentalize. If I can leave the dirty, dishes in the kitchen I can focus on my work. It gives me the flexibility that if I need to leave and go do stuff at the kids school and it's I've had those opportunities as they were our kids schools right around the corner I could allocate Mondays would be an office day but it also meant I could go have lunch with the kids at school and volunteer in the classroom for an hour. Nobody's you know supervising me to make sure I'm in the office at this time, whatever. My kids now are 13, almost 14 and 16, so they're a lot more independent, which means I end up working in my office a lot later in the day. So sometimes I have that struggle of breaking away from the office and spending the time with them or getting dinner started and putting it aside. But I have found that I try really hard on the weekends not to sit down at the desk. The weekends are busy enough with the kids' stuff, with home, you know, just the normal, the housework, the chores, the weekend stuff. And so I try to be very good about not looking at email on the weekends or in the evenings too late because inevitably when I do, there's something there that either gives me anxiety or something. So I would say, if you can, make sure your phone doesn't alert you to emails.

1:11:34 - Andy 
Yeah, but you don't have any problem getting started, like getting motivated?

1:11:37 - Laura 
No, not usually. I'm usually at the desk and working by eight. The challenge for me personally is that there's a ton of like personal emails, like the school emails and the church emails and all, and if I look at those and start working through those, then it might be nine o'clock before I start on the work stuff, but I'm at the desk and I don't have any problem getting motivated. It's just, I guess it's just my personality. It works well for us, Um, so it's been a good, I think it's been a good balance. It'd be interesting to see what my kids said as related to that. And then with my husband being an architect, it's nice because there are times I can run stuff by him. Um, I have had projects that have been mixed use that had commercial aspects. So I could run by him and say, okay, what does the code say for this? Or can you guide me on this? Or let's talk about the financial stuff or the marketing stuff. So it's good to have that. Um, And it's nice just to be able to talk about stuff and not have already experienced it together all day since we're not in the same office or the same type of work.

1:12:40 - Andy 
Yeah. Very good. Very good. Well, yeah, thanks for sharing about your personal life too and just aspects related to that. So, yeah, if there's nothing else that you want to talk about, I'll give you an opportunity just to share a little bit about where to find you and best place to look you up.

1:12:57 - Laura 
So, my firm is LFA Architecture. My website has a lot of information, I feel, about how I work, the projects I've done. It also includes some stuff on there about what I don't do. I'm not the cheapest architect. I'm not just a draftsperson. I really focus on historic work and on full service, which has a cost to it. But it can be really helpful for certain clients. Clients that might be out of town, that need somebody really supervising things on the ground. It can be really good for clients super busy that need to be able to focus on their work and know that I have things covered and well documented on the architecture side. So my website is lfa-architecture.com. That's probably the best place to find me. Not doing a great job with the whole social media thing, but maybe someday I'm working on some new marketing strategies and business development stuff. But yeah, right now the best way of the website. There's even a couple blogs on there and some information about navigating the BAR process, kind of where to start in terms of historic renovation, because it can be daunting. And then I'm always happy to answer questions. Yeah.

1:14:10 - Andy 
So if you've got an old house in Charleston or the outlying, and that we've talked a lot about proper Charleston. I mean, you do work outlying. I mean, I guess you probably do other states as well.

1:14:23 - Laura 
Well, I try to stay in in South Carolina and I have had some projects that were further away. I had a project, historic project in Bennettsville, South Carolina, which is about two and a half hours north of Charleston, up 95. And through that process, because I do full service and because I like to be at the job site once a week at least, and really available to my contractors and clients, decided I needed to stay more focused in the Charleston area and on historic work. So there is historic, homes in Somerville, and the old village of Mount Pleasant, and even around the islands. So there are those opportunities. I have the most comfort level, I guess, with the historic downtown Charleston area, just because I have good relationships with the city folks, the city staff, and the preservation folks and all. So I have my network there, but definitely willing to go all the way beyond for the right project.

1:15:20 - Andy 
design houses, and we've got some experience with one of those too.

1:15:24 - Laura 
We do.

1:15:25 - Andy 
We won't get into that too much today.

1:15:27 - Andy 
So thanks again, Laura, for being on the show today and really enjoyed it.

1:15:32 - Laura 
I had fun with this.

1:15:34 - Laura 
Thanks so much.

1:15:34 - Andy 
So you said you didn't do too much social media, but this will be one of your...

1:15:40 - Laura 
Yes.

1:15:40 - Laura 
I will be sure to kind of get it out there somehow.

1:15:44 - Andy 
Feather in the cap.

1:15:45 - Andy 
So yeah, we'll definitely share this with our audience.

1:15:48 - Andy 
and hopefully you can do the same.

1:15:50 - Laura 
I will.

1:15:51 - Laura 
Thank you for inviting me, and I look forward to lots more conversations like this and working together.

1:15:56 - Andy 
Yeah, very good.

1:15:57 - Andy 
Thanks, Laura.

1:15:58 - Laura 
Thanks.

1:15:58 - Madeline 
Hey, everybody.

1:15:59 - Madeline 
Thanks for listening to today's episode of Enhance, and please leave a like, a subscribe, or a follow, and we'll see you next time.